Obamacare: What the hell is it?

Discussion in 'Films, TV, Music, Books, Etc.' started by blobbohen, Jul 1, 2012.

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  1. blobbohen

    blobbohen Rookie

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    What's up, GR?

    Though I imagine most of you have already heard about the Supreme Court's ruling on the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act (colloquially known as "Obamacare") I figured that some of the posters on this forum may not be all that familiar with the actual content of the law itself, since polls are showing that the majority of Americans have no idea what's in it. To assist with combating that I'm offering a few of the law's more impressive feats below, in addition to some sources that help clarify what can be expected as the law becomes fully implemented. This isn't a public service announcement so much as an effort to foster discussion about a titanic law that was nearly axed this past week. After reading a few lines from below I'm pretty sure you'll be glad that it wasn't.

    Without further ado some effects of the law:

    • Beginning in 2014 it will be illegal to deny someone coverage because they have a "pre-existing condition." Simply put, the people that had in the past been denied coverage will, at last, have a means to acquire it.
    • Insurance companies can no longer place life-time caps on the amount of money that they can spend on you, and with this provision already in effect since 2010 it's a worry that's no longer necessary. Previously this restriction would allow an insurance company to get away with paying for a menial amount of something like a hospital stay and then leaving the patient to foot the rest of the bill.
    • You are now permitted to stay on your parents' insurance until the age of 26, provided your employer does not already offer you insurance. This provision has also been enacted already.
    • In 2014 state-run exchanges will be online, essentially allowing you a place to shop around for an insurance policy that suits you in terms of coverage and affordability. I'd also add that options for getting your insurance subsidized will also be made possible for people that want insurance but still can't afford it. Basically, the government helps you pay for your insurance, if you qualify to receive the assistance.

    Those are the four main points I'm going to list for now since a wall of text would be just as intimidating to many readers as the 1,900-page law itself. There's a ton of misinformation (really crazy misinformation) about what Obamacare does and does not do. To be certain, it is a very unpopular law, but only when it is talked about collectively since many of the individual features of the law are actually quite popular. So while you're at it read up on the most controversial component of the law, the individual mandate, since that has more or less been used as the primary fear-mongering device by Republicans and TEA party groups that wanted to frighten people about the law. It's nothing to be scared of since it is not going to apply to many people, though the effort to intimidate people has been very well-funded. Fighting propaganda with facts is how I'm trying to defuse the panic, I guess.

    If you're curious as to how other provisions of the law will work here's a page that lists the years and programs in a readable format for how Obamacare will be implemented. There seriously is a ton of way overdue updates and regulations with this law, and being familiar with them will go a long way in taking advantage of those programs. And last but not least I offer this: if you have a specific question about what the law can do please go ahead and pm me. If enough questions are sent my way I'll post my responses and leave them here on the forum for everyone to see.

    The reason I'm doing it this way is that the unofficial, self-appointed "Libertarian" quack of this forum has attacked and had gooey ragegasms all over his computer screen for just about every politically-oriented thread I've started here on GR, turning them into off-topic messes as other users try to calm him down and actually have a useful discussion. So to avoid his Ayn Rand-esque temper tantrums getting all the attention I'm inviting you to send any questions that you've got my way so I can focus on answering them and spreading the info around about how useful Obamacare really is and will continue to be. I think it will be alot more functional of a discourse this way.

    So go ahead and ask away by pm-ing me with any questions that you've got regarding this huge step forward in healthcare insurance for the U.S.A. Back when this law was still a bill I spent months working with different volunteer groups and community organizers getting Obamacare moved forward, and our efforts ultimately paid off. In the process I gained an intimate familiarity with many of the different clauses and changes of the law, so I figured that anyone wanting to know more about it could do so by asking me. If no one's curious then that's no sweat off my back since I've got a ton to do outside of clarifying a law that most Americans seem to be very puzzled by.

    My personal motivations for doing this are pretty simple: 45,000 people die a year due to not having insurance in the U.S., and that is a problem that other countries like England, Denmark, Canada, and Germany do not have. The experiences that my family and friends have had in those countries served as strong motivation for me to make America's system into one that helped sick people get better instead of bankrupting them. For me it's just that simple.

    So there you go. PM me with any questions, and if there's any interest I'll post my answers within a week or so. Good night and good luck, GR.
     
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  2. Eyebrowsbv31

    Eyebrowsbv31 Rookie

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    The idiocy is outstanding, I applaud you. If I had the time and energy to respond properly to this (which I don't because I have a job), I could just bomb you with information from sources a lot more credible than the NYT. Falling back onto insults before I even get a word in, wow, just wow, you must be really confident. Tell me again how government does such a good job keeping costs down, oh oh, or that one about financial regulation, or even better: how collective bargaining for public unions allows them to stack the deck in their favor is so good for the country!

    How's that OWS stuff going for you, manage to blow up a bridge yet?

    Here, I'll give you one about the insurance til 26: if you're enough of a damn failure to be a fully grown adult that has to suckle off the teat of your parents until that age, then some serious soul searching is required. how is that a good thing? How is saying, "hey, a good 3rd of the way through your life you still don't have to take responsibility for yourself! You incompetent youth!" I find it more insulting than helpful, but then again, I think for myself. If you want to be a ward of the state blob, that's fine, just leave the rest of us alone with your sloth and lack of responsibility. Insurance and big pharma are behind obamacare now: where is your OWS street cred now, eh?

    In the mean time, here's a picture of Willy Wonka:

    [​IMG]

    I love brainwashed rich kiddies.
     
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  3. Icepick

    Icepick Rookie

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    you know what's awesome for me? I don't have to understand any of that shit, because I live in a nation that isn't ass backwards on it's priorities.

    I, along with anyone else that lives in the free world, can't fathom why you don't want universal healthcare, not only do you not want it, you become very angry when the subject is brought up.... Americans are up in arms arguing if changing the system will be good, throwing around phrases like "death panels", but you're current system is shit, I mean, near third world shit

    "In 2007, health spending was $7,290 per person in the United States, more than double that of any other country in the survey.

    Australians spent $3,357, Canadians $3,895, Germans $3,588, the Netherlands $3,837 and Britons spent $2,992 per capita on health in 2007. New Zealand spent the least at $2,454."

    taken from http://www.reuters.com/article/2010/06/ ... SU20100623

    and it could be argued Canadians spent the most (besides Ah-murica) only because of how low our population density it, requiring more hospitals to cover a larger land mass while having 1/10th the population of the US.

    I just don't understand where the anger against the change is coming from, do you enjoy dealing with financial misery while trying to recover from an injury, or are you worried you wont be able to jump infront of drivers and sue for medical costs anymore?
     
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  4. kingg5

    kingg5 Rookie

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    lol someone struck a nerve. Some of the perks sound ok, but what about the bad shit to this law? In my opinion this law is taking away our freedom.

    Even with insuance being brought down to be so called "affordable" There are still maybe millions of people who still can't afford it. Mainly the homeless, beyond low income families, and jobless people living in their parents basement. I believe the reason the're doing this is to gather the funds we owe China.

    I give it a matter of time till people get tired of this and a new civil war is sparked. Not one that has to do with just one race's freedom but the entire countries freedom. My best bet is hike it to Canada before they close the borders.
     
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  5. Icepick

    Icepick Rookie

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    If shit hits the fan like you're expecting, you wont be able to cross the border, even if Canada is willing to accept refugees, America wont let it's tax dollars walk out on her. You're all fucked, and we Canadians have a front row seat, which will come to bite us in the ass when you realize we're a nation of vast resources and admittedly, a small army to protect them
     
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  6. Paradox

    Paradox Soaring Phoenix

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    Thanks for the info blob, although it was very unnessacary to just open fire on Eyebrows like that.

    And while I too worry about some young adults leeching off of thier parents, that's not always the case. Many places can bill two or three insurance plans for services, medical and drug. It's called coordination of benefits, at least in my line of work.

    An individual may have their own insurance and be on their parents. One plan is set as primary and the other secondary. The primary is billed, and the remainder is sent to the secondary. The doctor or pharmacy gets payment and the dual-insured individual saves cost.
     
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  7. Icepick

    Icepick Rookie

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    While I do generally agree with most of your views, the one about the 26 year old being pathetic is easily dismissed. After amassing 100k in debt for school, and than to find there's no jobs in this shit economy, you can't really fault the average individual for not being able to thrive.. let alone purchase there own house with both the incredible debt, and nothing but a minimum wage job to show for it
     
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  8. Eyebrowsbv31

    Eyebrowsbv31 Rookie

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    Because it leads to rationing, that's why. Why not take a look at england for example. We spend more in the US because we chose to. That's why when you factor out crime and auto wrecks (across the board) the life expectancy in the united states is number one. It's why the average emergency room wait time in the US is 4 hours compared to Canada's 24 (look it up). We Americans are also incredibly unhealthy; but that is the curse of being an incredibly wealthy society. Poor people, the "hungry" are the ones that are mostly obese here, for example. Also also, we pay for the worlds drug and meds innovation; Canada benefits from incredibly cheap pills, a luxury we don't have.

    I want universal healthcare, but I want to chose what and how I pay for it. Universal implies that all humans are robots, that all outcomes are the same.

    And it only seems to work, somewhat, in small countries; let's see China try it, eh?

    I've done it.

    That is a matter of stupidity of the individual. The problem is American colleges wanting warm bodies to pay up for worthless liberal arts degrees that high schools and the media push kids into. Look at me and links: we're both history grads, no jobs. I work with dozens of liberal arts majors doing nothing in their field, because there is no jobs. We need to stop sneering at vocational jobs and push kids more into engineering.

    Here's a start, can't find the series about it: http://www.jewishworldreview.com/cols/will061012.php3

    Education needs to be fixed first, then the others issues will follow.
     
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  9. Green_Lantern

    Green_Lantern Forum Moderator
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  10. Icepick

    Icepick Rookie

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    I can tell you from personal experience, the waiting time is bullshit, I've never waited more than 3 hours, but if you want to look at some rural hospital dealing with an influenza outbreak, sure you could make the statistics look daming

    As for america being #1 in life expectancy, you're far wrong, Japan sits at the top, with the US ranking 38th.. but hey... 38th, 1st, I'm sure it was just a typo

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_co ... expectancy

    you're fucking behind cuba for fuck sakes

    And small countries? You would think that a mall country would have a harder time as a result of less tax income, if you mean small as in coverage area, you are aware Canada is the second largest country in the world right?

    "We Americans are also incredibly unhealthy; but that is the curse of being an incredibly wealthy society"

    No, that;s the curse of being an incredibly foolish country, there's plenty of other wealthy countries that don't have rampant obesity, and I wouldn't call America wealthy given your record breaking debt

    If I go max out my credit cards, I'm not wealthy, I'm in the hole...
     
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  11. kingg5

    kingg5 Rookie

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    That was very enlightening lol. I better head up north soon then. Any suggestions on a beautiful part of Canada?
     
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  12. Icepick

    Icepick Rookie

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    So you demand freedom, than expect people to filter into the jobs the government wants you to do, as oppose to say, something you have an interest in?

    And I agree, the american educational system is in desperate need of fixing, anyone can see that, and that's what gives leverage to the american stereotype, but health care is a right, I don't understand how anyone can see otherwise, be you poor or wealthy, old or young, every should be entitled to the same healthcare. You continously argue that it wont work, and I see politician after politician claim it will cause chaos, why isn't Canada burnt to the ground yet? Why do we enjoy a better quality of life?
     
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  13. Icepick

    Icepick Rookie

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    if you want a hippy Cali vibe with ski slopes and gorgeous forests, hit BC, if you want to rough it like a pioneer, northern ontario, if you want to hide from the world, Saskatchewan. Our version of red necks hang out in alberta, our drunks in newfoundland, and our amish like folk in PEI, where you can farm all the red potatoes you want.

    If however you're into casual sex and having a snob argue with you wherever you go, and people who cant drive, Quebec is the place for you
     
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  14. kingg5

    kingg5 Rookie

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    What about people who like the country life and a small town vibe not far away?
     
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  15. Icepick

    Icepick Rookie

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    Manitoba or central ontario, I'm in a small town myself, but only an hour and a half away from toronto, it's pretty nice I have to admit
     
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  16. The_Joker

    The_Joker Rookie

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    Oh come on.

    I get enough of this shit on the gamefaqs politics board.

    Right down to the liberal majority and small group of Paulbots who no one else respects. Just in this case, there's only one paulbot.
     
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  17. danielrbischoff

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    I don't have the time or energy to ready all of this, but I'll tell you right now, blobbohen, that baiting another user is a fast way to get your shit locked. Also, don't treat us all like morons. Keep it civil or it'll get locked and put in storage where you can't hurt anyone.

    That goes for all involved, so watch how you talk to each other.

    I'm pissed.
     
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  18. Noritama

    Noritama Rookie

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    What did I miss?
    Edit: Ok I got it. Wow I thought I was crazy. <.< >.> anywho going to back away out of this thread slowly.
    [​IMG]
     
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  19. C_nate

    C_nate Rookie

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    So I read the birthday thread first and wondered what the fuck I missed. Then I just read through this and it all makes sense now.

    Anyway, my own 2 cents on the subject is that the health care system in America is in a bad spot right now and it needs to change. Is Obamacare the right answer? I don't know, all I know is that something needs to change and that bill is at least a start. Something to get things in motion. What bothers me is that the people who want to over turn the law have absolutely nothing that they want to replace it with. They just want to dump it and go back to what it was before when that is clearly not working and only getting worse as time goes on.

    I've been on both sides of the coin. Insured and uninsured and I've needed medical attention in both situations and I can tell you right now that the uninsured are screwed. The difference in care is unreal.
     
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  20. Lien

    Lien Rookie

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    Hey how's it going GR? What's this thread about?

    ...Oh... politics?...and eyebrow was the first to respond?
    [​IMG]


    PS: Nothing beats french healthcare... i mean even our aspirin is covered by the darn government!
     
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