Is it safe here? or How I Caged My Very Own Nicolas

Discussion in 'General Gaming' started by UrbanMasque, Aug 26, 2014.

  1. Bretimus_v2

    Bretimus_v2 Hey kiddo!

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    So you agree as to the credibility of all the mud slinging?

    Also, does the news and reviews really affect your purchases? I honestly buy things that look like they're in my wheelhouse and avoid the rest. No group of assholes on Hangout is going to force me or you to buy a game. Whether they are fighting over who gets to post the first review or chastising each other for web content, that's not changing the quality and purchasing control you and your debit card have.

    And GR being in that email chain. lol. I like to think they're not because...

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    #61
  2. UrbanMasque

    UrbanMasque Everyone Wears a Mask

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    "off the rails"
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    Reviews sway me when graphics & gameplay get my attention... so I will DEFINITELY be paying more attention.
     
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  3. LinksOcarina

    LinksOcarina Rookie

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    Yeah I tend to agree with this. bleitbart is not exactly a good source...although there are no good sources out there for this entire debacle so far...
     
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  4. used44

    used44 Forum Moderator
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    Haha. Breitbart. Such an upsetting website.
     
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  5. Commiebot

    Commiebot Novice

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    Much as I dislike Breitbart, I at least halfway respect Milo in this instance for investigating and reporting developments. How many more times will Gamergate opponents try to shove Zoe and Anita back into the spotlight and try to frame things around harassment? How many more months-old news stories will Kotaku conjure to deflect from the issue of ethics and possible agendas?

    As for how the news goes in the grand scheme, I'm concerned with the number of good games and developers I may never hear about because someone deemed some material 'problematic and upsetting' and it got buried. Some of the best games of this last generation I only heard about from word of mouth or youtube channels.
     
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  6. Sourdeez

    Sourdeez Rookie

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    Well it doesn't matter because gamers are dead, the talking heads told us so. :roll:
     
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  7. StudioTan

    StudioTan Regular

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    I have a bit of an issue with these 'Kickstarter' games whose huge financial backings are poorly handled and the projects ultimately fall to the wayside and become cancelled. Some of these games had budgets over half a million dollars. I'm not trying to derail this topic. I thought it may also be relevant to corruption in the gaming business.

    http://www.gamerevolution.com/news/figh ... aign-28471
     
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  8. Lien

    Lien Rookie

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    This threads needs more nic gifs. Seriously, i still can't tell the difference between Tea Partiers and those gamergate/quinnspiracy/Kotaku are run by lizards conspirator. Especially when if you look at the grand scale, NO ONE CARES ABOUT THIS!

    Let's turn this into a nic cage thread darn it!
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    Also, out of topic, You should check this out, Tan. Though i doubt kickstarter is part of the huh... corruption... that people are talking about, nice to know they will enforce harsher rules.
     
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  9. MikeyVassallo

    MikeyVassallo Rookie

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    But they have been harassed. Viciously and disgustingly so. I don't think the ridiculous amount of vitriol and hatred slung at these women matches whatever made up sin concocted by some of these folks.

    The bottom line is this isn't a watershed moment in history. There is nothing to expose. Girl may have cheated on guy. It may have been with folks in higher places. There may be some fuzzy ethics involved, but none of that is our business. And zero of it deserves the attention it is receiving from either side.
     
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  10. madster111

    madster111 Rookie

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    And you think zoe doesn't deserve it, why?

    She shut down a charity event so her scam 'charity' event (that pays to her personal paypal) could make her more money, who cares what that cunt gets.

    Meanwhile, people like you are purposefully shifting our focus back towards 2 useless humans instead of focusing on the fucking media conspiracy where a large group of individuals dictated what the general public should hear/see and that whole minor thing where a high profile indie developer can be charged with something as serious as the RICO act. And don't give me shit about it being a minor thing involving video games, we're talking literal millions of dollars here, more than enough for it to be a serious felony and jail time.

    The video game industry is worth over $80bil at the moment. The sooner people stop treating it as a minor thing, the sooner we might see some lawmakers attention paid correctly to this industry.
    After all, look at how much attention is paid to the movie industry. That thing that's worth a pathetic $40bil, including bollywood.
     
    #70
  11. UrbanMasque

    UrbanMasque Everyone Wears a Mask

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    [​IMG]

    If you don't care, dont comment - but the "indifferent" parties trying to stymie discussion based on this line of reasoning is SOOOOOOOOO interesting. Who should be addressing the fuzzy ethics here if the businesses/journalists/reviewers are complicit. No one? How long until this type of behaviour then becomes industry standard if you don't flag it as fucked.
     
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  12. MikeyVassallo

    MikeyVassallo Rookie

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    Nobody deserves harassment of that magnitude. She could very well be a despicable human, but the bizarre fixation on trying to destroy her is ludicrous.

    Also, people like me aren't trying to cover up a conspiracy dude... A conspiracy doesn't exist. This is a huge case of a need for some of you to grow the hell up.
     
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  13. MikeyVassallo

    MikeyVassallo Rookie

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    Urban, I kind of expect more from you. Why would you want to restrict free thought from any party on this subject?

    Also, I'd you don't think favors for favors aren't already an industry standard in most... Well... Industries then I have some swampland to sell.

    Anyhow, sorry for coming back from the dead and crashing your topic.
     
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  14. Sourdeez

    Sourdeez Rookie

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    I agree with you Urbz and the length at which people will go to irrationally defend a woman in the industry is astounding. She is a human being, another person, not an angel that is blasphemous to criticize.

    I don't think if the gender roles were reversed that we would see the same reaction we do out of the community. We would see less people defending scam artists and corrupt journalists. People are so focused on gender that they want to defend women in the industry even when they know they are defending a scam artist and then they completely miss that most people don't want this to even be about women they want it to be about the corruption going on in the industry.
     
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  15. UrbanMasque

    UrbanMasque Everyone Wears a Mask

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    [​IMG]


    I'm extremely curious about this entire situation, but restricting free thought is NOT-AT-ALL what I'm about here. The more input the better, but what I'm pointing out is - you're not indifferent. You think this is being blown out of proportion. From what I can see - people like links, commie, and madster are trying to look past her at the overall "conspiracy web", but they're constantly being confronted with Zoe being used as a shield so it seems like people are harassing her (which some people admittedly are) but because you want to know more about this doesn't place you in the MRA troll category.

    i dunno, just my interpretation..
     
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  16. MikeyVassallo

    MikeyVassallo Rookie

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    Fair enough. Love you.
     
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  17. Lien

    Lien Rookie

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    Ok fine, i'll say my piece here then i'll head off. But first...
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    All right... let's dive into this. If this long text bored you, chances are you were only here for the nic cage gifs. There will be some after the TL;DR.

    Hey urban, it's "opinion" like these why Gamergate/quinspiracy/Obama is born in Kanya discussion gets discredited since day one, not because it's being entwined into a conspiracy web. Links is playing his own version of the word "skepticism" when he forgot that word means any sources he can get may be totally wrong including the one that challenges the popular stance that he hates, Commi is just letting his passion get the best of him instead of trying to form an actual argument but ultimately falls into logical fallacies of none-existing issues and then... we got Madster... enough said about him cause if we do, he's going to start posting some chat logs with red markers and then say something silly like how an indie event, that's being hosted by 5 guys to help their friends and colleagues get attention in the press, is corrupt or something crazy like that. These are the only people who want to talk about this issue with you. Let that sink in.

    But No, i am not going to address to what's really wrong with this discussion. No, just the worst part in all of this. And that is you Urban.
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    Which is why I've been avoiding this thread for a good while now until you said that last piece there, cause like Stall said, we love you. But damn it, you can be an a-hole. It's you and only you here in GR who think this is a valuable topic to discuss by not taking a stance in this. Not saying you and those three guys up there don't discuss this between you and each other nor does Reddit threads don't exist, but like that video i just linked before said, No. ONE. CARES. about this. Every con goers just shrugged it off or rolled theirs eyes cause no one wants to join mob mentality who doesn't have a clear goal (and still doesn't, corruption in what? to whom? for whom?). Everyone only want to play games and none of the issues discussed here or anywhere is stopping them from doing that. Game critics facepalm as soon as they see the word "4-Chan" on the screen grabs. Game Devs, be it indie or AAA majorly agree that this "movement" does NOT defend them and discourage new people to participate in the industry. In fact, some of them even think that even though they are not being named, this is attacking them, making them feel like they are being silenced by a mob mentality. Some actually WERE silenced and even left the industry all together! (nice job "fixing" the industry!) I am not getting into what the marginalized community member think of all of this because people like Madster and Commi have their comments being defended by you, Urbs, for the principle of "debating". But please keep making it sound the victims are "shielding the criticism" instead of actually admitting that... your stance makes people who feel targeted feel even more miserable in general. This fake neutrality is destroying and dividing the gaming community more then the conspirators do. You are not uniting people here, just defending the most passionate side.

    And then, there are these points that are the main motivation why the gaming press (and anyone with rational thoughts) are staying away from this:
    -Zoe Quinn sleeping with the five guys for good press has been debunked in the first week. Her personal life around her EX is none of anyone's concern except for those who like to "slut-shame" her or women in general (that's an actual term, it's a form of Ad Hominem, look it up).
    -Kotaku/Polygon covering up their trace being this also has been debunked since this was a none-issue to begin with. Any article that defends their authors is... just that. Like any news media, an editor has every right to stand by their writers. No one is being bribed or blackmailed. They are just being Bros.
    -Harrassers, and by that i mean people with a personal agenda against Kotaku, Polygon, Zoe quinn, indie devs, phil fish, people who hates being told that their games are not perfect, are using this debacle to justify and being encouraged to perform personal attacks, insults and hacking against various group of people, some not even related to the mess while still clinging to the claim this is helping everyone so they can go to sleep with a smile on their face and more therapy session for their victims.
    -Game Devs, publishers, industry are all either laughing at this mess, crying, or angry that their ACTUAL concerns are not being addressed (bad management, in-work discrimination, bribery, enforced corporate sponsors, employee lay off for bad reviews, not being defended for criticizing the industry and the gaming community, etc...)
    -Multimillions gaming corporation have yet to be addressed for their behavior except and maybe the Bioware and EA employee cause they defended the victims of the harassment. That part where the Sony CEO had to land because of a fake bomb threat is irrelevant. Instead, people address quite passionately the indie companies, indie conventions, indie press and indie game devs who most are struggling just to find funding and supports yet alone decent lawyers for copyright claims and are being discouraged to continue their works everyday. People justify this by saying "well it's different cause they are a-holes" and I'm like... "Have you met Bobby Kotick"?
    -Has been proven again, and again, that this whole "debacle" was created in 4chan boards, reddit threads and whatever echo-chambers that refuse to listen to rational thoughts and even being encouraged by Zoe's disgruntled Ex to make this movement into something bigger like "gaming corruption" so their bias views on gaming and their behavior against people's gender, race and sexuality have value. There are people who still claims this isn't about this anymore... doesn't change the fact said boards and Ex and linking their blogs and twitter comments while taking the credits for it. I'll give you a hint, popular opinion doesn't always mean it's fact. The world was proven to be round thousands of years ago but it took another thousand years for the average people to catch that concept. Disbelieving all sides but your own will only enforced an entrenched morality unless you challenge it first before turning it into an issue.
    -That previous point is also the main reason why gaming media does not cover this conspiracy and not because they are under a "web of silence" or whatever is being thrown around against them. Let's also add that the mainstream media, from all around the world, cannot see any value in all of this except for the harassers and people pushing a right wing like agenda in social media calling this "the new Tea Party of the internet". So unless Zoe Quinn/kotaku/polygon/Obama's racist pastor also slept with German, French, Japanese, Italian, Arabic and Spanish press people too, it seems that everyone is "placing you in the MRA troll category" even with everything addressed here. The media can only conclude that this discussion never had a support to stand on while everyone in it is being fooled into thinking it does.
    -And finally, the final point and the most important one. Because anyone neutral in this who tries to bring in this discussion (like you Urbz) are trying too hard to make it meaningful and distancing themselves from the quote "few" harassers by claiming they either do not speak for the majority or that they are being addressed by this. Cause they are not... they keep popping up, they keep trying to ignore the "other side" which is pretty much anyone who disagree with them, most of theses harassers do not know who Quinn is nor have they even got involve with her, they see a unguided mob, they jump in to throw stones. They've done so in the past, they will do so again in the future. Saying nothing during a stone throwing only gives more value to the mob mentality. There is nothing noble in doing this, there is nothing noble in supporting a movement that tolerates them or just claims "not all gamers". Again, this reminds me of when (White) people clinged to the idea that Obama was born in Kanya and then we had (other white) people who didn't believe in this none-sense... but still wanted Obama to address that issue because "Transparency" and supported the birther for a while. Still didn't stop them after he showed the long form birth certificate.

    By the way, not going to link screen grabs or videos or whatever to each of their points. This isn't a matter of facts, it's a matter of dignity and respect that is being addressed in my list.


    So bottom line, Urbz, if you want people who want to have a meaningful discussion on corruption in the industry here, follow the victims' of the harassment point of view (not just Quinn) and realize this is an BIGGER issue that needs to be addressed instead of just shrugging it as random trolls doing random things. As much as you want to talk about corruption, this cannot be ignored because it's being linked. Fail to realize so and then nothing and i mean NOTHING of value will be learned in this thread no matter how much Madster hates Phil Fish and gives you hope that random racist anon is the hero we need. Show that Quinn has nothing to do in all of this not by saying she's not the topic anymore, but BY DEFENDING HER from her harassers no matter what you think of her personally, start listing everything good she's done and why she doesn't deserve the hate beyond the fact she's a human being. And not just her, also anyone else who tried to defend her and got bullied into silence, anyone who claimed that the gamers are irrational people will still link this discussion to the attacks but gets shut down under waves of comments and name calling e-mail. All those people, you gotta start saying they got every right to speak up and stopping them or insulting them is morally wrong starting in this very own thread. Fail to do that and the people sensible to sexism issues, the indie people, the gaming media, the gaming developers, the gaming publishers, the one in charge of corruption and the mainstream press will still think the gamers needs to grow up and people outside of gaming and will still think we are a niche group who performs circle jerk for the sake of their own ego. Regardless of any "proof" that is being thrown around here, this is a hate movement that is being rejected and ignored by anyone outside and are slowly starting to agrees that maybe "Gamers are dead". Prove it wrong, Urbz, not by showing what we can learn of this, but by listing what is wrong in all of this first beyond "Harassment is bad M'kay?" Lead by example, not by principle.

    Of course, a better way is to simply abandon this thread and just reset it under another thread unrelevant to quinn/phil fish/gamergate/Bhengazi but somethings tells me you still want to find any "valuable" discussion as you feel the conspirators are being victimized for reasons not linked to their choice of words. You still refuse to see their flaws and that's why me and Stal are sighing at you right now.

    Like my father once said, "You can't talk about fixing the plumbing while the house is on fire." So, doze off the flames, Urbz,
    And don't add fuel to flames by saying it's needed.



    TL;DR
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    I'm out! You can select pieces of my long text to dismantle or ignore it all whatever. Don't care anymore cause I got a GaymerX convention to prepare for next year so that me, GR staff, kotaku writters, polygon writters and the couple of thousand LGBTQ audience can all sleep with Quinn to corrupt gaming some more like we all did in the previous two years. Can't wait to see what her Ex will come up next into duping Urbz he's helping gaming history!

    Disclaimer: Quinn is one of the nicest girl you can meet in real life. The same cannot be said of Madster of whom Urbz is saying is awesome.
    Disclaimer disclaimer: I have not met Madster and probably never will until he grows out of his south park mentality no matter how much weed he will be sharing. I also suspect he slept with Urbz seeing he think his conspiracy links are "Awesome" even though anyone with a brain cell sees how bogus it is.

    Meanwhile, in ferguson.
     
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  18. Sourdeez

    Sourdeez Rookie

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    Dude, anyone who seriously agrees that gamers are dead is higher than I am. Please share the koolaid with the drugs in it.
     
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  19. UrbanMasque

    UrbanMasque Everyone Wears a Mask

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    EDIT: Dude, no tits. What are you an idiot? I'm ashamed in you - <3 MattAY

    If you're not going to bother to read the response, then I won't bother to write one..
     
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  20. MattAY

    MattAY Forum Moderator
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    Lien, the TL;DR part was too long!
     
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