I just don't know anymore...

Discussion in 'General Gaming' started by Cali, Nov 26, 2008.

  1. Cali

    Cali Rookie

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    Warning: It's likely that this post might piss some, if not a lot of people off. Keep in mind that you are welcome to criticize and flame me all you want, just don't bore me.



    I'm honestly thinking about giving up gaming, or something like that, unless game companies are going to be more innovative from here on. I mean, honestly. Games nowadays are processed, dumbed down, overpriced, unoriginal, casual packages with just a few redeeming qualities.

    Here's a quick perception of some of the things I think about the industry now:


    The Elder Scrolls Series:
    Elder Scrolls I: Arena was an innovative first person open world RPG.
    Elder Scrolls II: Daggerfall refined what was in Arena. A colossal world, an extremely deep character system, nearly limitless replay value. A timeless game.
    Elder Scrolls III: Morrowind, even though I like it as my gateway RPG, was astronomically shallow compared to Daggerfall.
    Elder Scrolls IV: Oblivion was comparable to Morrowind. Only slightly larger, and embarrasingly simplistic RPG elements.

    Conclusion: The first two installments of the Elder Scrolls series didn't sell well at all. Bethesda knows that they can now make more money by making dumbed down games, and will continue to do so.


    Warcraft Series:
    Warcraft: Orcs and Humans was the first Dune II knockoff, and was actually good.
    Warcraft II: Tides of Darkness was a simple, yet finely crafted game.
    Warcraft III: Reign of Chaos was an innovative RTS that let loose a little bit of RPG into the franchise.
    World of WarCraft was an MMORPG that mainstreamed the genre and brought a bunch of newfags in that don't know and don't care about the genre's RTS roots or the lore for that matter. Unfortunately for me, I don't care even the slightest bit for MMORPGs.

    Conclusion: How can Blizzard make another true RTS WarCraft title? They can't, because they know they can make more money with MMORPGs. A StarCraft MMORPG is imminent.



    RPGs as a whole:

    Deus Ex was a beautiful FPS/RPG hybrid with complex RPG elements and morally knotted decisions within the story.
    Deus Ex II: Invisible War was a dumbed down, simplified, and broken shell of a game that could have been much better.
    Deus Ex III is confirmed to be an adridaline induced shooter with a Halo like damage system (Seriously. Bring back health bars people.) and no RPG elements.

    System Shock was a cult classic that pioneered the FPS/RPG hybrid.
    System Shock 2 was to System Shock 1 as what Steel is to Iron. It did not sell well, and was the final nail in the coffin for Looking Glass Studios.
    Bioshock, was the spiritual successor to the System Shock series. While a decent game, it was more or less a spaid version of the said series that dissapointed many fans, but attracted many newfags and casual gamers.

    Final Fantasy was the mother of JRPGs that produced a unique party system.
    Final Fantasy II-V were excellent continuations to the genre.
    Final Fantasy VI was the flagship of the genre, towing in excellent RPG elements, a profoundly good story, and cool cutscenes.
    Final Fantasy VII was the epitaph of the series, with a shallow character and inventory system, and a less satisfying story. Fortunatley for Squaresoft, it mainstreamed the franchise and raked in big bucks.
    Final Fantasy VIII was a slight improvement to Final Fantasy VII, but it's like comparing Oblivion to Morrowind.
    Final Fantasy IX-XII followed in VII's footsteps and produced the same watered down gameplay.

    Rogue suprised the RPG community by incorporating real time combat rather than a turn based system. This was a benchmark.
    Diablo was a tribute to Rogue, and refined it's combat system and is considered to be one of the most influental RPGs of all time.
    Diablo II was a much larger game. While snapping on a much more deep character and skill system, made it significantly easier than the first Diablo and it required less skill (that is, if you weren't playing it on Hell or Hardcore).
    Diablo III, according to Blizzard is going to have a prerendered skill system that you cannot customize. No skill trees everyone. Thanks a lot Blizzard.

    Fallout: A Post Apocalyptic Roleplaying Game put console RPGs in a new light with an inintimatible character and stat system and fun turn based combat.
    Fallout 2 was a longer harder game than the first Fallout and sported much more depth and variety.
    Fallout Tactics was a delightfully tasty mix of RPG and strategy.
    Fallout 3 was made by Bethesda after Black Isle collapsed. As with Morrowind and Oblivion, they watered it down and made a highly controversial decision to make it an FPS/RPG hybrid rather than an isometrical RPG. Todd Howard and the rest of the team did this because he mentioned that isometrical games are unimmersive and would not sell well to mainstream gaming public. Sadly, this proved to be true, as Fallout 3 outsold the previous games.


    Conclusion: RPG's are not even RPG's anymore. They're watered down games that focus on graphics and stories rather than gameplay. Game companies still make these kinds of games because the general public doesn't like complicated games, and instead want storylines and gameplay that holds your hand and tells you where to go. Bah.



    Bottom Line: Games were never meant to be mainstream. I'd love to have more people in my hobby, but these people all want watered down scotch. It's like filmmakers who want to make a comedy, realizing that Woody Allen type comedies will bore the hell out of everyone, so they make Superbad knock offs that are even more raunchy and stupid, because that's what everyone likes.

    While I still have some hope that games nowadays will rebound, I'm realistic enough to think that it's not entirely possible. It's going to take something drastic to restore my faith in the gaming community. Very drastic.


    Discuss, sympathize, flame, or tell me that a topic like this has already been made (I don't lurk much here anymore).
     
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  2. MattAY

    MattAY Forum Moderator
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    You cant get a lot more innovative than a Wii at the moment? Also...try playing some other games ;) - resort to the top 100 topic not far below or above this topic!
     
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  3. LawnGnome

    LawnGnome Rookie

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  4. Lentium

    Lentium Rookie

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    Play old games, ignore hype, be patient.
     
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  5. Cali

    Cali Rookie

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    lol wut?

    No, seriously. I'm not talking about innovative consoles, I'm talking about innovative games. And as for the top 100 topic, it's a completely different concept from what I'm talking about.

    And other games? What other games do you have in mind?
     
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  6. Kiristo

    Kiristo Rookie

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    I agree with the Blizzard summaries. They've yet to make a bad game, really, but will likely stick with MMOs and make Diablo III more MMO like. I like Morrowind more than Oblivion, and it's one of my top 3 games, I was very depressed to see how they'd dumbed it down. I like WoW, so I usually just play that when there's nothing new that looks good, but FPS are a good way to keep entertained I find. Even cookie cutter FPS are often fairly fun, it's fun to just shoot someone in the face sometimes.
     
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  7. Solaris10

    Solaris10 Rookie

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    Blizzard died when World of Warcraft was born in my opinion.

    Starcraft 2 = 3 games...no frigging way.
     
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  8. AMANIAC

    AMANIAC Rookie

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    I'm much more a shooting games man, myself, so you can understand why i don't agree with you about a lack of good games anymore.
     
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  9. Mistajiggyfly

    Mistajiggyfly Rookie

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    It's not just games, you can't look at any aspect of media in general that doesn't show this happening now a days. The plain and simple fact is, the majority of the population is made up of morons, and unfortunately, companies market to the majority.

    Anywho, I couldn't agree with you more on pretty much everything you said.

    Although I did enjoy Bioshock, granted I never got the chance to play the System Shock games.
     
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  10. Lord_Fornelius

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    You know, I can understand giving up video games when you become bored of them, but not in protest of the lack of inovation or them. Besides, you sound like some stuck-up, smug, hippie-douche who has his head stuck so far up his ass. I mean what games did you program in your entire life? And how many of them were noticed for their uses in innovation? Are you also going to give up driving? I am, because car companies aren't making hover cars yet.
     
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  11. Mitchy_Slick_253

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    this guy is awesome and he speaks the truth
     
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  12. Green_Lantern

    Green_Lantern Forum Moderator
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    Of course game companies are going to create games to relate to a more generalized public...Its all about the companies making a profit...

    But who cares, just play the games for the enjoyment that they bring, rather than thinking about how the first one was better than the third or fourth...
     
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  13. Boringman54

    Boringman54 Rookie

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    If you put Zelda on your lists, I would have to beat you.
     
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  14. Mistajiggyfly

    Mistajiggyfly Rookie

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    I think you missed his point, he's saying games are slowly getting worse. Sure you wont give up driving because they haven't made hover cars, but what if someone told you that you had to drive a Model T for the rest of your life? Personally I'd be buying a bike at that point.
     
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  15. De-Ting

    De-Ting Rookie

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    Zelda: The first game was all the series really needed. The rest are just like...wtf? The gameplay has evolved from game to game, but the storyline is worthless. They shouldn't have kept using the same characters and retelling Link's story differently in every stinkin' game.
     
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  16. Mitchy_Slick_253

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    ocarina of time revolutionized RPGs and the target system
     
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  17. MattAY

    MattAY Forum Moderator
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    I know what De-Ting means. I am a little tired of the ganondorf thing. One of the main reasons I was so excited about Twilight Princess was because of Zant - he was a new and refreshing bad guy (pretty badass until the end too). Then Ganondorf had to stroll along again!
     
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  18. ZankerH

    ZankerH Rookie

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    If you want innovative concepts on their own, play free/Free indie games (protip: the likelihood of a free game being awesome increases with the age and elitism of it's community. If you're not welcomed by an RTFM and condemned to a LART, reconsider your choice). If you want polished innovative mainstream games, well, they come up once or twice a year, but it's a bit "meh" the last few years, I'll give you that.
     
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  19. UrbanMasque

    UrbanMasque Everyone Wears a Mask

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    Amen.. in otherwords keep on trollin buddy,

    the story line in todays RPG's have advanced right along with the technology. IMO. You do sound like a lot of my hipster dofus friends in the bay area who wont let go of the NES and think that FF2 and Kings Quest are the best games on the market.

    Ultimately, you are a republican when it comes to gaming. You HATE change.


    OTher than that - I'm Urban... nice to meet you.
     
    #19
  20. Longo_2_guns

    Longo_2_guns Forum Moderator
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    Shut up. Seriously, I am sick of listening to guys like you.

    As the demographic changes, so will the games. Since the demographic has changed from basement-dwelling PC things to humans, so will the games. Saying a game is bad because it has been dumbed down is like saying a movie is bad because it has subtitles, allowing everyone to get the jokes, or because a butcher starts cutting more fat off the meat so health nuts will eat some. Mostly, I tend to feel that you are just upset because you feel that all the new *COUGH COUGH* mainstream gamers *COUGH WHEEZE COUGH* didn't go through the same rite of passage as you did, making them inferior.

    Also, nostalgia factors into this somehow.

    And if Daggerfall is a timeless game, how come no one but the aforementioned basement-dwellers have played it.

    In closing, shut up plz.
     
    #20

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